Tip or sculpt?? Which do you prefer??
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VHunter
Well-Known Member
Why wouldn't sculpting be appropriate for a biter?
I've done it a several times.
Now, mind you, there are many on this site who's work is much better than my own. Don't get me wrong, I am NOT tooting my own horn. Just explaining what I do and my personal choice.
But, I found that it actually looked better and nicer too compared to previous work when I only tipped them.
One thing I found when tipping biters was depending on how low they had bitten their nails, if I tipped them, it would sometimes put the nail at a funny angle because it's following the direction of the nail at 'that' point, OR because of the years of abuse changing the shape of the natural nail, they'd ski-lope upwards. Whereas with sculpting, I can just angle the form whichever way I want the nail to go.
The other glitch with biters is that if they'd bitten them REALLY low, there really wasn't much room for blending a tip, even if using well-less tips placed as close to free edge as possible. This headache is gone if I sculpt.
Also, tipping biters, sometimes require saddling or trimming the sides of tips. I can't be bothered with all that fuss. To my mind, if the tip needs that much work to go on the nail, then I'd much rather sculpt and put the product where I wanted it in the first place.
All that time and fuss, cutting, filing the tip even BEFORE putting it on. UGH drives me BANANAS.
In some cases, if necessary, I create a false free edge, THEN apply my forms. It varies case to case, depending on how bad it is.
So, having said all of that.
And please note, I do indeed have SEVERAL biters who started with sculpts and now sport NNO's...with rarely any breaks.
So, my question is, why is 'sculpting a biter' a fallacy??
I've done it a several times.
Now, mind you, there are many on this site who's work is much better than my own. Don't get me wrong, I am NOT tooting my own horn. Just explaining what I do and my personal choice.
But, I found that it actually looked better and nicer too compared to previous work when I only tipped them.
One thing I found when tipping biters was depending on how low they had bitten their nails, if I tipped them, it would sometimes put the nail at a funny angle because it's following the direction of the nail at 'that' point, OR because of the years of abuse changing the shape of the natural nail, they'd ski-lope upwards. Whereas with sculpting, I can just angle the form whichever way I want the nail to go.
The other glitch with biters is that if they'd bitten them REALLY low, there really wasn't much room for blending a tip, even if using well-less tips placed as close to free edge as possible. This headache is gone if I sculpt.
Also, tipping biters, sometimes require saddling or trimming the sides of tips. I can't be bothered with all that fuss. To my mind, if the tip needs that much work to go on the nail, then I'd much rather sculpt and put the product where I wanted it in the first place.
All that time and fuss, cutting, filing the tip even BEFORE putting it on. UGH drives me BANANAS.
In some cases, if necessary, I create a false free edge, THEN apply my forms. It varies case to case, depending on how bad it is.
So, having said all of that.
And please note, I do indeed have SEVERAL biters who started with sculpts and now sport NNO's...with rarely any breaks.
So, my question is, why is 'sculpting a biter' a fallacy??
Doorie
Well-Known Member
I sculpt biters too 
maybe I do something wrong but it lasts longer when I sculpt, and of course, less pain in the butt to meet all requirement
maybe I do something wrong but it lasts longer when I sculpt, and of course, less pain in the butt to meet all requirement
geeg
Judge Gigi-Honorary Geek
We have discussed this before but if you are refering to my post, then I don't say sculpting is not appropriate for biters. I think tipping is easier and gives a smoother and longer lasting result IN MY experience and opinion.
I do not sculpt on severe biters. That is my choice. I do what is going to be the easiest and quickest for me (saddling a tip takes no time at all for me) and give the prettiest and the longest lasting reult for the client.
Putting a form of the shape I want on a severe biter takes longer than saddling a tip I can assure you ... for me ... and the results I'll be happy with anyway.
I do not sculpt on severe biters. That is my choice. I do what is going to be the easiest and quickest for me (saddling a tip takes no time at all for me) and give the prettiest and the longest lasting reult for the client.
Putting a form of the shape I want on a severe biter takes longer than saddling a tip I can assure you ... for me ... and the results I'll be happy with anyway.
VHunter
Well-Known Member
Your work is always lovely Geeg, I'm envious.
But I was referring to Carl/Nailzoo who said it was a fallacy. Sorry, didn't mean you. I was curious why he said it was a 'fallacy'.
And I find since "I" started sculpting, my nails are stronger and longer lasting and better looking. Now maybe it's because I've gotten better in general or maybe it's because I found a way that worked. Or both, no idea. I couldn't really say.
Mind you, I was always slow with tips and they drove me nuts LOL
But I was referring to Carl/Nailzoo who said it was a fallacy. Sorry, didn't mean you. I was curious why he said it was a 'fallacy'.
And I find since "I" started sculpting, my nails are stronger and longer lasting and better looking. Now maybe it's because I've gotten better in general or maybe it's because I found a way that worked. Or both, no idea. I couldn't really say.
Mind you, I was always slow with tips and they drove me nuts LOL
My thoughts are very much the same as Geeg, with the same reasons, (yet you choose to pin me down, doubt me and question me as an individual) when it is now commonly accepted procedure.
Once upon a time everyone said sculpt nail biters .....
well if you do sculpt on nail biters, those hideous bulbous ends that you sculpt over (on a real nail biter) becomes a weakness under the nail (a thinner area), which, as the nail grows out leads to breakage in a very short period of time (which leads to customer dissapointment).
With tips you can force this bulge down into shape, it adjusts quite quickly and grows out quite well. Also using tips creates instant sidewalls and instant shape with less effort.
I'm so pleased to hear you are becoming (or have become) in such a short period of time a "sculptress". Almost to the point of being a sculpting snob
Hopefully this means you have binned the "tip and dip system" .... ooops.....did I say tip ? I guess you can only dip now.. Or perhaps sculpting with gel is easier (or your forte).
From my personal experience and in my defense, I am talking acrylic (which is my forte), yet your weakness.
Perhaps you can post some before and after pictures of your sculpting on nail biters success stories (without them being covered in nail art) and I (and others) can learn from the system and methods you use.
There's a nail biter (more a nibbler) full set video on my website to start it off (I would "never" have sculpted on her in a million years (unless I charged her double for my time and effort).
Everyone should post their nail biter sculpture pics (and tips too), or direct us to previous posts containing pictures of true nail biters, then we can compare end results and learn from each others experiences.
I also mean true nail biters, not merely "nail trimmers". This is perhaps where people differ.
Once upon a time everyone said sculpt nail biters .....
well if you do sculpt on nail biters, those hideous bulbous ends that you sculpt over (on a real nail biter) becomes a weakness under the nail (a thinner area), which, as the nail grows out leads to breakage in a very short period of time (which leads to customer dissapointment).
With tips you can force this bulge down into shape, it adjusts quite quickly and grows out quite well. Also using tips creates instant sidewalls and instant shape with less effort.
I'm so pleased to hear you are becoming (or have become) in such a short period of time a "sculptress". Almost to the point of being a sculpting snob
Hopefully this means you have binned the "tip and dip system" .... ooops.....did I say tip ? I guess you can only dip now..
Or perhaps sculpting with gel is easier (or your forte).From my personal experience and in my defense, I am talking acrylic (which is my forte), yet your weakness.
Perhaps you can post some before and after pictures of your sculpting on nail biters success stories (without them being covered in nail art) and I (and others) can learn from the system and methods you use.
There's a nail biter (more a nibbler) full set video on my website to start it off (I would "never" have sculpted on her in a million years (unless I charged her double for my time and effort).
Everyone should post their nail biter sculpture pics (and tips too), or direct us to previous posts containing pictures of true nail biters, then we can compare end results and learn from each others experiences.
I also mean true nail biters, not merely "nail trimmers". This is perhaps where people differ.
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I had a true nail bitter for my first assessment at college. Acrylics it was and I had to tip, I was not happy with the finished result, it was only my second full set of nails. I would have liked them to be shorter but she didn't. You can see pictures on my profile under my Acrylic training.
I tip at the moment because I am still training, but I will try and master scuplting.
I tip at the moment because I am still training, but I will try and master scuplting.
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VHunter
Well-Known Member
WOW
I feel like I've been smacked with sarcasm, and I certainly wasn't trying to be a snob. I'm not a snob actually. I believe both are equal. I just feel it's "easier" and less fuss for me.
I'll try to respond as best as I can.
:hug:
I feel like I've been smacked with sarcasm, and I certainly wasn't trying to be a snob. I'm not a snob actually. I believe both are equal. I just feel it's "easier" and less fuss for me.
I'll try to respond as best as I can.
My thoughts are very much the same as Geeg, with the same reasons, (yet you choose to pin me down, doubt me and question me as an individual) when it is now commonly accepted procedure.
I wasn't "pinning" you down, I just wanted to understand your statement regarding the word "fallacy". I still don't understand what you mean by "fallacy". That was the only thing I questioned. What's "false" about sculpting biters?
Once upon a time everyone said sculpt nail biters .....
well if you do sculpt on nail biters, those hideous bulbous ends that you sculpt over (on a real nail biter) becomes a weakness under the nail (a thinner area), which, as the nail grows out leads to breakage in a very short period of time (which leads to customer dissapointment).
With tips you can force this bulge down into shape, it adjusts quite quickly and grows out quite well. Also using tips creates instant sidewalls and instant shape with less effort.
This I understand, regarding the bulbuous area. If the biter is bad enough that she has a 'bulbuous area". I don't question this and have to agree.
This is where I learned one of my methods for biters:
http://www.salongeek.com/newreply.php?do=newreply&p=776510
Are these not considered real bitten nails?
I'm so pleased to hear you are becoming (or have become) in such a short period of time a "sculptress". Almost to the point of being a sculpting snob
Not sure if you're poking fun, or praising me for tackling it. I'll take it as a compliment, but I am by no means a snob.:hug:
Hopefully this means you have binned the "tip and dip system" .... ooops.....did I say tip ? I guess you can only dip now..
Gel has become my preference (but I am by no means an expert and STILL have TONNES to learn), however, I still do "tip-n-dip" on a regular basis for those that prefer it, or for more temporary nails as my gel is NOT a soak off. It's popular in Montreal, and an accepted form of nail enhancements.
I just did a set for a 12yr old this morning for her grade 6 graduation. The option was either A) I do tip-n-dip OR B) her mother was taking her to the NSS down the street for L&P. While I don't approve, this isn't my child, and I'd think tip-n-dip to be the lesser of two evils in this case, so to speak.
From my personal experience and in my defense, I am talking acrylic (which is my forte), yet your weakness.
YES, Acrylic is my weakness which I can NOT wait to learn and take my course. So of course, I can't comment on it. Only on what I've read of other people's experiences with it.
Perhaps you can post some before and after pictures of your sculpting on nail biters success stories (without them being covered in nail art) and I (and others) can learn from the system and methods you use.
I will certainly try to do so the next time. I'm not trying to sound all expert, just saying I've had some success. I'm certain you and Gigi are far better for offering tips on this sort of thing. And I repeat, I only hate the 'fuss' of tips, and not the tips themselves. I personally am not adept with 'trimming' them for saddling. As I said, I don't understand the "fallacy" part. What was meant by it?
There's a nail biter (more a nibbler) full set video on my website to start it off (I would "never" have sculpted on her in a million years (unless I charged her double for my time and effort).
Everyone should post their nail biter sculpture pics (and tips too), or direct us to previous posts containing pictures of true nail biters, then we can compare end results and learn from each others experiences.
Definately agree!
I also mean true nail biters, not merely "nail trimmers". This is perhaps where people differ.
:hug:
Vetty
Lost and happy geek!
Ok, here's one I did last year. Here's the before:
http://www.salongeek.com/gallery/showimage.php?i=6077&catid=searchresults&searchid=7748
And here's the after:
http://www.salongeek.com/gallery/showimage.php?i=6078&catid=searchresults&searchid=7748
I used natural tips with white in z1, coverage pink in z2 and translucent pink in z3 (all CND). They aren't perfect, my tips are under-sized and I could have made the white smaller for a more flattering look.......
Hope it helps someone......
excellent Vetty, those fat ends would have been "uuuugh" to sculpt over
Vetty
Lost and happy geek!
Thank you :hug:. Agree about those fingertips - I believe in making my life easy and having confidence in my end result....... I apply that 'principle' to all my clients
:idea:You haven't been smacked, ......but consider yourself "tickled"
fallacy - definition of fallacy from YourDictionary.com
It has often been said "sculpting is the only and recommended way of dealing with nail biters".
I suppose over my many years this has been disproven, yet still lingers as "fact" in the minds of some that haven't been around quite so long (therefore it's a fallacy).
I think this is false and untrue, :see "fallacy", .....(hey, it's almost a "myth").
Your link to nail biters led me back to this post ( I so wanna see it).
I'd still like to see pictures of your own success stories with sculptures on nail biters, it would look great on your website (which you don't advertise much in here). ShortAmericansAmberStones *wink wink*, no link. (Hey that ryhmes)
.It would really show off your skills an entice new clients, I haven't found many in your gallery/website, or have you updated or deleted lately?
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VHunter
Well-Known Member
You haven't been smacked, ......but consider yourself "tickled"
fallacy - definition of fallacy from YourDictionary.com
I knew what fallacy meant :lol: I just wasn't sure what you meant by using it LOL Hey, you're talking to the walking dictionary here haha
I can live with "tickles". It's all good:wink2:
It has often been said "sculpting is the only and recommended way of dealing with nail biters".
I suppose over my many years this has been disproven, yet still lingers as "fact" in the minds of some that haven't been around quite so long (therefore it's a fallacy).
Ok, so you're only saying that it's not the "only" way, and not necessarily the 'best' in all cases, but you're not saying it shouldn't be done. Am I understanding better now?
I think this is false and untrue, :see "fallacy", .....(hey, it's almost a "myth").
Your link to nail biters led me back to this post ( I so wanna see it).
I'd still like to see pictures of your own success stories with sculptures on nail biters, it would look great on your website (which you don't advertise much in here). ShortAmericansAmberStones *wink wink*, no link. (Hey that ryhmes)
It's actually something I've been intending to do. And 2 weeks ago, I wanted to smack myself silly because of a transformation I had done on a biter, and forgotten to take "before" pics. Trust me, I was MAD! I've been wanting to a do a 'nail biter' page when I update my site and revamp it (hate the layout now) and add support and tips and tricks on it for biters.
I used to have my link here, but was getting spammed by people selling stuff, so I removed it. It's easy enough to find my site, google "ongles chez victoria" and voila.
FYI.. short american amber stones were done tip-n-dip :lol:
It would really show off your skills an entice new clients, I haven't found many in your gallery/website, or have you updated or deleted lately?
I rarely use the gallery because I usually just update to my regular online album. I hate uploading, and doing it twice drives me bonkers.
Here are some reformed biters if you want, but they started as sculpts and are now NNO's. And yes, there is art SORRY. I'm known for it, and 99% of my clients are addicted to it and won't go without. Since it's always 'under' the gloss to protect it, you'll likely never see nails without, from me.
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b...ral - Funky mani/TaniaFRGlittergreen8fgrs.jpg
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b.../KellyFrMusicalNotesJBJ8fgrs.jpg?t=1212770484
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b...ibre/BelindaFlameFrench8fgrs.jpg?t=1212770534http://s21.photobucket.com/albums/b...ew¤t=KellyTapestryredandcream10fgrs.jpg
Some ovals I tried and couldn't get right.. STill trying to master that shape. I don't get much practice at them because it's not the "thing" here.
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b...al - Funky mani/JaniceFRglitterStarfish3D.jpg
My "FIRST" (or second?) sculpt with White gel, on a biter
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b...ural - Funky mani/GinaFRsculptednailchain.jpg
My "first" glitter sculpt, and a biter as well
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b...ral - Funky mani/TracyJblueglitterFR8fgrs.jpg
My "First" oval sculpt, on a biter. Her 'before' from another session is attached (never uploaded it to site as I was unimpressed with final result, so couldn't pair them as before and afters) She is often on the road as hubby is a trucker, so when she's gone for months, I usually have to start fresh again (didn't like these either, but here ya go, with all my flaws)
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b...y mani/LauraMaRubyRedstilletoesstars4fgrs.jpg
So there ya go. Those are my attempts on biters. None seem any more prone to breakage than any of my other client's.
They're all ecstatic to have reached NNO's status now.
Feel free to attack them. Most of those are pretty old now and I 'hope' I've gotten better:o
PS
Oops attached wrong pic LOL
That's the after that went all wrong. I was "trying" to do a two tone french with cover gel... yeah. 'try' being the key word LOL THANK GOD for nail art and the patience of friends hahaha
Attachments
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VHunter
Well-Known Member
PS: my whole album/gallery is accessible via the photo page on my website
OnglesChezVictoria - Photobucket - Video and Image Hosting
My site:
Victoria's Nails ~ Ongles Chez Victoria
My site is crap. I used to like it LOL not anymore. But I leave it there for the time being. Crap site better than no site. After the wedding, hopefully, time to do what I've been planning.
PS: the gallery features pics from way back when, including the 'bad'.. I left them there for the 'art' ideas and not the resulting nail shapes. Lots of tip-n-dip in the early pics.
OnglesChezVictoria - Photobucket - Video and Image Hosting
My site:
Victoria's Nails ~ Ongles Chez Victoria
My site is crap. I used to like it LOL not anymore. But I leave it there for the time being. Crap site better than no site. After the wedding, hopefully, time to do what I've been planning.
PS: the gallery features pics from way back when, including the 'bad'.. I left them there for the 'art' ideas and not the resulting nail shapes. Lots of tip-n-dip in the early pics.
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VHunter
Well-Known Member
Good pictures, ("after a few week pictures are cool"), it would be great to see before and after (even including the already damaged cuticles) side by side (as an indentifiable set improvement), you know what I mean.
Would be nice to see some sculpts before and afters.
I know what you mean by the "bad", i've left some of my less than proud moments online also.
I'll remove them in time, but they have had so many hits on youtube (up to 70,000), it seems a shame to remove them, as they apply to realistic work and the outcome under salon conditions.
I've even posted "bloopers" to show that anyone can make mistakes and cringe when I am reminded of them.
Really bad ones should be deleted though, to demonstrate accurately where you are at (the present), otherwise people may be put off by where you were, opposed to where you are now.
Enough about "you" & me/mine, i'd like to hear others thoughts on the subject at hand.
You Can look at my albums on my profile,one nail bitter in my gels album and one in my Acrylics album. I know they are not very good as they are only my second ever set of Acrylics and Gels. I am getting better and doing more training. But any remarks that will help me improve are welcomed.
femmefan
Well-Known Member
I have only dealt with a couple of nail biters (I'm still in training) but in both cases the only way I could keep a full set of nails on for longer than a week was to sculpt. I do seem to have more trouble generally with tipping so I may be doing something wrong with this method, but I find fitting forms and sculpting very easy and hope to become expert enough to almost do away with tips unless the client absolutely insists:lol:
sparklybits
Well-Known Member
I much prefer the look of sculpts and would offer this before tips and overlay.
I always use the revers application for perfect smile lines time and time again:hug:
I always use the revers application for perfect smile lines time and time again:hug:
geeg
Judge Gigi-Honorary Geek
You can't say this unless you are saying you much prefer the look of YOUR sculpts.
Some sculpting is horrendous and does not look better at all.
You can't just say to and recommend to everyone that their sculpts will look better than tips because they won't necessarily look better at all.
