Affirmation ... why do so many need it?

[geeg]

I think all the responses have been very good and that is what I was craving really ... a bit of discussion instead of ... will you look at my website ... think of a salon name for me .. do my homework for me .. or tell me what you think of my logo.

Yes maybe I am a bit bored of seeing all these kinds of threads but I do understand that people want or need affirmation. Maybe I would have wanted this 25 years ago if it had been available to me but it wasn't ... and I knew what I wanted but certainly did not always get it right.

By the way, all I said was I (personally) didn't get it!! I didn't say it was wrong to seek affirmation but asked if this attitude boded well for future success? At some time we all have to make major decisions without necessarily being able to ask others what they think.

However I do think this site is for more than just seeking affirmation ... I hope it is also for intelligent discussion and learning ... THAT is the reason it was started and of course those are the sorts of questions that are so valuable .... questions that we all learn from and that maybe aren't so all about me me me. A good healthy mixture of questions would be nice wouldn't it?

 

[Bev Rose]

I agree Cathie, it is a hard one really.

I think it is different when you have a design or logo in mind and just want some help in deciding, like an affirmation if you like, that what you picked was what others liked. Kind of cements it.

However, I have seen a couple of threads looking for a business name and it is like pulling teeth to get any info at all, now that drives me mental! :irked:

I agree with Fifi on this.

As someone who works alone, I recently asked advice on a logo on here - I knew which one I liked, but wanted feedback from other people in the industry with similar businesses to give me their thoughts about what it looked like - the impression it gave etc.
Yes, I asked my husband (he works for the local water company) & my kids (still at school) for their thoughts, but they have not got an insight to this industry & although I listened to their opinions, I asked on here.

As for the threads - 'please tell me what to call my business/salon' - I think that is lazy, how can someone know exactly what a person offers to give a name that's suitable - and why can't they think that one out for themselves??? I never open those threads.

 

[angelnailz]

A good healthy mixture of questions would be nice wouldn't it?

Totally xxx

 

[bombini]

But the thing is, noone is going to say if they think your logo is pants....well, if they do they will get a backlashing for it as I discovered lol ! These things are always a matter of opinion and everyone has their own opinion. If it's your business and your future, it's ultimately your decision. Ask family members and friends what they think, they're more likely to give you honest opinions, good or bad.

I know 100% about working on your own and that is why this site has always been a godsend to me as I can network with other professionals, sort out any product or service issues and hopefully help a few others along the way. :hug:

I agree with this, some of the ones Ive seen look 100% naff from a variety of designers. The thread poster obviously likes it otherwise they would have gone straight back to the designer and complained rather than post it on here.

I don't mind giving my opinion on logo's. The only trouble is that they all look the same. Is it the same company doing them?

Yes I think 99.9% of them are !

I posted a comment ages ago about them all looking the same and was told that it was because the people asking for them were wanting logos like other geeks. Well firstly why would you want to base a logo on a fellow geeks and secondly as a designer shouldn't you advise against that ?!

Having said all of that I can see the point of asking for reviews of websites especially when they have been self built, it helps to hear feedback on the layout, etc.

 

[redsadie]

Not sure about what you mean about posting to keep the site going, there are always plenty posts that do just that!

I was being pedantic :hug: I was tired and needed to go to bed

I think yes, a lot of people are new start-ups on here and don't work in a salon, therefore do not have any one to bounce ideas off. They may know what type of design they like (if we're talking about logos) but sometimes, you may have an opinion on two or three and cannot decide which one to go for, so they (maybe after asking family ect.) come on here to see what their peers think. Family and friends are ok but you do need a peers opinion (IMO) and this is just the place to come and get it (so I thought).

Isn't this type of query exactly what chit-chat was designed for??

xx

 

[The Pink Orange]

Great thread...I wote a tipsy blog with a very similar moan! It is great to ask advise and to get fab ideas from others but I think some geeks are having their businesses run almost buy other geeks, buy posting everything on here. I don't get it either!! How do they find time to post about every little detail?! I'm guessing they aren't busy with clients!

 

[geeg]

"I don't know for sure but I suspect the designer is using some kind of on the shelf design your own logo software that you can purchase from PC World. "

As someone who's responsible for some of those designs...I find that rather offensive...and its certainly not the case at all- and if you think they're naff then you're entitled to your opinion. I do apologise if my work annoys you- genuinely.

I'm also not a "loosely termed" designer. I'm a degree qualifed designer who produces lower cost solutions to an industry where there's not LOADS of money swilling around.

Frankly, I'd take it as a compliment if people are asking for advice/assurance- a business name and logo/look ISN'T personal. They're business tools engineered to encourage business- and if people can't ask their peers who can they ask?

I disagree that "a business name and logo/look ISN'T personal". I think that it should be a mixture. I too have found many of the logos displayed here on the site very uninspiring (not saying it is the poster's work or not .. I haven't a clue) and they do not appeal to me as a woman. Many have been a variation on a theme and do look very similar. But that is not really what this thread is discussing is it?

I think (for myself) one just knows when something is right and it is not always necessary to ask. People come on the site and say ... "can you think of a clever name for my business?" That's it. They don't tell you a thing about what they envisage .. not a thing about what their business will offer ... not a thing about where it is, mobile, salon or home etc ... Do you think that that casual attitude bodes well for future success for that person??? No one has answered that yet!!

Everyone seems fixated on either justifying why they asked for affirmation or asking, isn't that what this site is for?

 

[Verve Designs]

"But that is not really what this thread is discussing is it?"

Granted no- but im allowed to have my say about that! :lol: If someone said someone's nails were rubbish im sure people would fall on 'em from a great height! There was also the slight inference in one post that I'm ripping people off...and I resent that. They're making an honest assumption. But are wrong.

Actually, I agree that it's a mix. It has to be personal to the extent that you're happy with it personally (and it says something about YOU)...but with an eye to what it's supposed to achieve in terms of appealing to other people in a quick, visually symbolic way. A logo represents your company to the outside world- and posting on here is a chance to get almost instant feedback from that "outside world"- people would have killed for that 20 years ago.

"Whats a good name" is different I suppose as its starting from a completely blank page..and is just an exercise in mind-reading.

p.s. If the powers that be arent that happy with people posting logo's in here...please let me know, i'd be more than happy to ask them not to.

 

[angelnailz]

I notice as I'm sure we all have ... that in the last few weeks there have been a gazillion threads asking us to look at logos, web sites, salon names etc. and give opinions.

My question is ... why do so many need the affirmation of others to make a decision? Do they not have any instinct for what is good and what isn't? And does this apparent insecurity bode well for a successful future in business?

In running and starting a business people are going to have to learn to make their own decisions and not need to seek affirmation constantly from others that what they are doing is OK. Is it just me?? I just don't get it. I really don't.

I think I attempted to answer the original question above in my previous post.

I think (for myself) one just knows when something is right and it is not always necessary to ask. People come on the site and say ... "can you think of a clever name for my business?" That's it. They don't tell you a thing about what they envisage .. not a thing about what their business will offer ... not a thing about where it is, mobile, salon or home etc ... Do you think that that casual attitude bodes well for future success for that person??? No one has answered that yet!!

Everyone seems fixated on either justifying why they asked for affirmation or asking, isn't that what this site is for?

I think the question above is a totally different one, someone who may be insecure is completely different to someone who just expects others to do all their thinking for them, and to answer your question, if they have the latter attitude then no I don't think that bodes well for their future success! :hug: xxx

 

[essentia]

I think it is nice to have others give a viewpoint about a logo/design you are thinking about as it can be lonely working on your own! However I agree with Gigi it is the threads that say "come up with a business name/tell me from scratch what I need to start a business/what skincare do I buy" type of thread that is a yawn. This lazy element reminds me of the "I can learn nails/beauty/hair in a day" kind of person who wants it dropped at their feet. Therapists do need self reliance and do need to do research, training, thought process and application it takes to be a professional. This is a very open forum and I am not aware of any other professions having such openess and I wonder if it is to our detriment at times.

 

[Blue Rose]

I agree with Fifi on this.

As someone who works alone, I recently asked advice on a logo on here - I knew which one I liked, but wanted feedback from other people in the industry with similar businesses to give me their thoughts about what it looked like - the impression it gave etc.
Yes, I asked my husband (he works for the local water company) & my kids (still at school) for their thoughts, but they have not got an insight to this industry & although I listened to their opinions, I asked on here.

As for the threads - 'please tell me what to call my business/salon' - I think that is lazy, how can someone know exactly what a person offers to give a name that's suitable - and why can't they think that one out for themselves??? I never open those threads.

Up until recently I probably would have agreed with you but we can't all be tarred with the same brush. Having asked for some advice myself in this vein recently, perhaps sometimes it's just an initial lack of inspiration.

It was for me & since my post have come up with several possibilities.

 

[Mrs.Clooney]

I think all the responses have been very good and that is what I was craving really ... a bit of discussion instead of ... will you look at my website ... think of a salon name for me .. do my homework for me .. or tell me what you think of my logo.

Yes maybe I am a bit bored of seeing all these kinds of threads but I do understand that people want or need affirmation. Maybe I would have wanted this 25 years ago if it had been available to me but it wasn't ... and I knew what I wanted but certainly did not always get it right.

By the way, all I said was I (personally) didn't get it!! I didn't say it was wrong to seek affirmation but asked if this attitude boded well for future success? At some time we all have to make major decisions without necessarily being able to ask others what they think.

However I do think this site is for more than just seeking affirmation ... I hope it is also for intelligent discussion and learning ... THAT is the reason it was started and of course those are the sorts of questions that are so valuable .... questions that we all learn from and that maybe aren't so all about me me me. A good healthy mixture of questions would be nice wouldn't it?

When the same old threads keep popping up, I suppose it can get a bit repetitive and dull, but then each and every person here is a different individual with different tastes and ideas. I do not think it is an attitude which may have any effect on future success.

I post on here because I want to share my knowledge and experiences, but I also want to learn from others. The geeks on this site are my colleagues because I am self employed and I work on my own.

When fairly recently posted a thread for comments about my new website, it wasn't because I was unsure about how it looked or nervous as to how it might be received, but because (a) I was excited to share it, (b) was interested in my colleagues opinions (c) hoped that someone could point out anything I may have missed eg. spelling errors as several pairs of eyes are better than one. I don't think it means that somebody is not confident.

I consider myself a mature, intelligent and well educated person and I believe I got to where I have by asking loads of questions and advice and listening (but not necessarily agreeing) with other peoples opinions from a young age.

I think it is sensible to ask for opinions on logos, websites etc.... What may appeal to one person in terms of a design, may not appeal to the wider audience and hence some perspective is needed.

Just yesterday I had somebody point something out re my website which I took on board and am now making the necessary small changes because I think the input is correct and valuable.

What I do think is a shame, is people who come on here for quickie answers or opinions, only to disappear off into the sunset. This site isn't about take, take, take, but is also about giving and sharing and contributing.

 

[geeg]

I think it is nice to have others give a viewpoint about a logo/design you are thinking about as it can be lonely working on your own! However I agree with Gigi it is the threads that say "come up with a business name/tell me from scratch what I need to start a business/what skincare do I buy" type of thread that is a yawn. This lazy element reminds me of the "I can learn nails/beauty/hair in a day" kind of person who wants it dropped at their feet. Therapists do need self reliance and do need to do research, training, thought process and application it takes to be a professional. This is a very open forum and I am not aware of any other professions having such openess and I wonder if it is to our detriment at times.

ha ha ... Good point ... have we been too helpful?? Well I'd rather be that way than not ... it is this attitude that makes the site what it is now is it not? You take the good with the bad.

However, I think that 3 pages of post in less than 24 hours on this thread shows how much we do like to discuss issues rather than just answer questions .. especially questions that are not very interesting except to the actual poster him/her self.

finally ...

This lazy element reminds me of the "I can learn nails/beauty/hair in a day" kind of person who wants it dropped at their feet.

I've been dying for someone to say that. My personal opinion is that the ones who fall into this category haven't a hope in hell of building a successful business. You know the ones.

 

[Blue Rose]

I've just done a quick google search on 'how to think of a business name' & funnily enough it's not just us geeks that are stuck for inspiration. There are plenty of threads on many different forums asking the same questions about biz names.

 

[Mrs.Clooney]

I think it is nice to have others give a viewpoint about a logo/design you are thinking about as it can be lonely working on your own! However I agree with Gigi it is the threads that say "come up with a business name/tell me from scratch what I need to start a business/what skincare do I buy" type of thread that is a yawn. This lazy element reminds me of the "I can learn nails/beauty/hair in a day" kind of person who wants it dropped at their feet. Therapists do need self reliance and do need to do research, training, thought process and application it takes to be a professional. This is a very open forum and I am not aware of any other professions having such openess and I wonder if it is to our detriment at times.

You have said this very well. These are what I refer to as the 'grab and run brigade' and I agree with Geeg that it is unlikely these peeps will be successful.

 

[angelina221]

Oh god i am the most unartistic person in the world so having someone elses imput is vital for people like me!
My daughter is actually very artistic and she designed my logo.
I know what i like when i see it but i just can't visualize things till they're done.
I'm in the beauty industry not the graphic design industry.
How many clients ask questions about treatments as they've never had them before and they want to know every detail. Your input is invaluable to them. Peoples input on here is invaluable to some people.
Have to also add that Carl has done the design for my website. I literally just gave him a few patterns that i like (which my daughter had found for me!) and he came up with my beautifully designed site!
I shall apologise in advance as when it's all finished i shall ask peoples opinions on here to see if there is anything i need to add/delete etc.....

 

[geeg]

Oh god i am the most unartistic person in the world so having someone elses imput is vital for people like me!
My daughter is actually very artistic and she designed my logo.
I know what i like when i see it but i just can't visualize things till they're done.
I'm in the beauty industry not the graphic design industry.
How many clients ask questions about treatments as they've never had them before and they want to know every detail. Your input is invaluable to them. Peoples input on here is invaluable to some people.
Have to also add that Carl has done the design for my website. I literally just gave him a few patterns that i like (which my daughter had found for me!) and he came up with my beautifully designed site!
I shall apologise in advance as when it's all finished i shall ask peoples opinions on here to see if there is anything i need to add/delete etc.....

Why would you need to apologize for lack of artistic ability or asking for feed back about your web site?? This thread is clearly not criticizing people for that ... it is more the 'serial' posters as I think has been made quite clear in the posts above. It wasn't ever just about logos and websites but a whole range of things.

 

[High Hopes]

Its not really the "what do you think of my logo design" threads that bother me because your creating a brand and its a bit like market research i suppose. Getting feedback from an idea that you have already established.

Its the ones like "please choose me a business name because i havent even thought about it one little bit" that i dont even bother to open. When someone hasnt even thought about what they would like to use as a business name its worrying that they are thinking of setting up a business at all, for surely in the grand scheme of opening and running a business this is one of the more straight forward decisions.

A few times i have thought about posting a list of all the business names i can think of just to have somewhere to direct these people but that wouldnt help them in the long run.

To run a business you have to have complete confidence in yourself and your decisions (in my opinion) and that includes choosing a suitable business name.

 

[TweezerHappy]

When I came asking for help re name and logo I already had the name and logo, I just wanted the opinions of the professionals. Then I was going to change my name slightly then number1kitty suggested another change to a name that I now love and everyone I mention it to thinks it's a great name. I really don't think I would've come up with it without asking.
Posted via Mobile Device

 

[Verve Designs]

I guess the bottom line is that we're lucky to have something/someone on hand to bounce ideas off.

Only 15 years ago you'd have killed for a tool like this- I worked for an agency where you'd literally have to send people into the street to get feedback.

Some questions are going to be more interesting than others, but you dont have to read them.