Disillusioned with the state of the Nail Industry? - here's one for us ALL to debate!

[*Garfield*]

Training is the biggest problem, imo.

should there be a minimum qualification people should have before even attempting extensions - Yes is my answer.

For example i would've found it extremely difficult near impossible to do my degree without my GCSE's. Basic English basic maths etc so I think nail techs should have if you like a GCSE in manicures pedicures etc before advancing.

So despite my first bad experience my passion and determination has willed me too succeed. And I will.

I think this is a really good point...I think its high time that it was compulsery to do a recognised manicure course before being able to go and do an enhancement course, that way some of the groundwork has been done, teaching about sanitisation, nail disorders, and the structure of the nail etc.

 

[Mrs.Clooney]

I'd like to add this to the debate if I may. I may be throwing the cat among the pigeons here, so here goes.......

Mention has already been made about formulating business plans, researching for the best and most cost effective training, calculating how much product you use in a treatment, keeping up to date with knowledge etc...............
This is all very well, but you have to know that this is available before you can investigate it.

For example, when I first started out in nails, I thought that Bio Sculpture was the only nail system available. I didn't know any different and if you don't know any different then you don't know that there is any research to be done. I might have looked further for my training had I known that there was other training available.

The nail industry was something COMPLETELY new to me, having come from a third world country where you only got your nails done if you were getting married!

My point is this, if somebody hasn't the business acumen or money to explore new avenues then are we perhaps being a bit harsh regarding other's ability to succeed?

 

[Lellipop]

Good thread Sassy I have lots of things that bug me about our industry Anyone seems to be able to set up a nail course and some people will do these so called courses and then go on to do nails they may do someones nails and then this brings our industry down because everyone thinks nail enhancement ruin nails when it is poorly advised techs who do the damage. I hate the fact that some techs even the very qualified will think their nails are fab when they are far from it I think that all nail techincians should aim for prefection and never turn out shoddy work no matter what the problem... correct it
I personally couldn't care less if some techs charge £15 I for one dont and never will because I am making a living If some techs choose to use cheap products and charge cheap prices then that is up to them but cheapness shows in their finished nails.
I have done nails for many years and when I started out not many nail techs were about in my area now there are many but I have seen nails done at 3 of the local salon which were shocking and they charge £45 a set and I have seen mobile £15 which also were bad So I would encourage the public to go on word of mouth and get good nails done reguardless of price.

 

[naturalnails]

This thread really got me thinking - I have never done a business course and I am embarrassed to admit that I never did a business plan.

I think I am quite an intelligent person and am able to do my own accounts within reason to be able to analyse how much each service brings in etc.

I decided that in order to grow my business I should look at doing some business courses - I went to Business Link and spoke to a lovely lady who is going to send me some information and then I can make a free appointment to discuss further how to move on:

Business Link

Thanks Sass for moving me out of my comfort zone LOL

 

[CadenceAlex]

It is only the Nail Technicians themselves that are damaging the industry - and the bored housewives who are taking the courses :lol: - I swear one company actually advertises how housewives can do the course, it's that easy!

No offence to housewives by the way!

The people who do it 'on the side' and ruin peoples nails too.

There should be higher standards set in this country for Nail Technicians... IN FACT, the whole education system in this country is wrong. People who can't read/write and spelll are making it in professions (like teaching) that they wouldn't ordinarily be able to with the lowering of educational standards.. like the NVQ and the access to Higher Education. I should imagine being taught by an illiterate teacher is potentially (actually, obviously) more damaging. Same as the so called tutors who teach nails - they couldn't care less.

In college, do the bored staff get to pick a straw to decide who teaches Nails?

EDUCATION is important - people WILL pay top price for a top service - why don't many nail Technicians see this? Because they're NOT top Nail Technicians.

Why are Creative Technicians sought after? And the other top companies? And why are so many people failing with their 2 day course certificates?

People are just happy to kid themselves.

I personally HATE doing nails right now and cringe when people come in wanting them. Because I KNOW I have 99% more to learn and I don't want to offer a half assed service in my salon.

If you're going to do a job, do it properly... :lol:

Sorry to be offensive!!!

 

[*Garfield*]

This thread really got me thinking - I have never done a business course and I am embarrassed to admit that I never did a business plan.

I think I am quite an intelligent person and am able to do my own accounts within reason to be able to analyse how much each service brings in etc.

I decided that in order to grow my business I should look at doing some business courses - I went to Business Link and spoke to a lovely lady who is going to send me some information and then I can make a free appointment to discuss further how to move on:

Business Link

Thanks Sass for moving me out of my comfort zone LOL

I went on a course with Business link when I started out, and they were brill, they give you loads of help if you are just starting out, they helped me do my business plan etc, and tell you what documentation you need to be keeping for the taxman.

 

[Sassy Hassy]

I think the problems are:

1. Enhancements are no longer 'in fashion'. Unless techs keep right up to the minute with trends, then clients may as well go to the £15 a set mob and have pwetty lickle palm twees on their hoofs in the middle of winter. Natural nails are in and there's a big market out there for regular manicures up for the taking.
I pretty much agree here, but do you think the trouble could be as much as Melody Jayne says - it's the white tip, too lng, square fake, chav-porno image that nail extensions are about, rather than the elegant naturally enhancing look that is the real skill of our trade. If you are enhancements are good then people shouldn't know you are wearing them - reminds me of the old Sunsilk (or was it Harmony?!)ads - is she or isn't she wearing any hairspray!!!

2. Regardless of who the trainers are, unless regular courses are taken, then skills won't improve. However, we should't lose sight of the fact that not everyone can afford to continue training..................especially when they're not making any money from nails in the first place. And, especially when they were promised by there trainers that they'd be able to charge £40 a set.
I agree that a lot of responsibility falls on the lack of scrupled of some of the training providers "Do a 2 day course and you can earn hundreds a day" well of course the lure of the cold hard cash is there ... but as with all these things if it sounds too good to be true then it probably is. And I think it should also fall to the responsibility of the trainers that they make it clear that investment into further training WILL be needed.

I know a lot has been said about Alessandro on here that's not been so great, But with them you signed up to an initial package, which was quite pricey BUT it included as much training as you wanted as long as you were with the Company. You were assessed annually and given an annual licence to be able to use their products. So whilst a lot what they spouted was pure garbage I actually think that this work ethic is one that many places could learn by!

3. I've said this before and I'll say it again............We're not brain surgeons, WE DO NAILS. WE think they're important but you know what? Clients don't give a damn as long as we're cheap and quick.

Yup like Becki it pains me to agree with you, and I think this is probably what I find hardest about doing nails as a job. Although I think it is just fab when a client says, my colleague at work had her nails done and I looked at them and they were awful, nowhere near as good as yours. Except on the flip side it is sad that clients really don't care about what they look like and will put up with such shoddy work, and that there are techs out there doing such shoddy work!

 

[gillian w]

I would just like to add that this is also the same for the beauty industry as a whole ..how many courses are there where you can go off for a day or two and become a beauty therapist.
How can anyone learn to wax properly in a day or become an aromatherapist in a weekend.
I blame the examining boards for the slide in standards and not the people taking the courses.If the courses are there to do people will take them.
We also have a situation whereby every college now seems to offer beauty courses but of course there are not enough good teachers.
I have no knowledge at all of teaching but could go and get a teaching job at the college and my teacher training then runs alongside it at the same time ie you have to be already teaching so many hours to get on the teacher training course,whats that all about.

 

[Marlise]

I also think undercutting affects retail to, you only have to look at ebay to see various nail products (Retail & Pro) being sold at knockdown prices sometimes less than trade price and some of the sellers are nail techs themselves with salons. A salon i know sells creative enamels at £8.50 :irked: My clients openly admit that they will buy the products off the internet if its cheaper.

Couldn't agree more. I sell all of my retail stock at the recommended prices and I virtually get no income from it. Why ? Because like you my clients are only to happy to "brag" to me that they can get it cheaper on Ebay. Some of them even have the "cheek" to show me the stuff the bought of Ebay when I go and see them next :irked:

I've tried to explain to them that you can never be sure about what you are getting, but I have to admit, all the ones that have shown me the products that they have bought off Ebay have been legit. How do you argue with that ??

I've said this before and I'll say it again............We're not brain surgeons, WE DO NAILS. WE think they're important but you know what? Clients don't give a damn as long as we're cheap and quick.

Unfortunately, I need to agree with this statement as well. Most professionals are passionate about their chosen career. Be it a dentist, dog groomer or musician.

I am sure that there are dentists pulling out their hair wanting to die seeing what people do to their teeth or more accurately the lack of looking after their teeth. What do we think, I brush my teeth twice a day and floss (if you are being particularly padantic about it) and that's that !

I'm sure a dentist could give you a LONG list of things of how the techniques and brushes we use are probably not right and using supermarket toothpaste is probably not as good as professional toothpaste etc etc. Do we care .... no.

Thanks to the NSS and a flood of "cowboy techs" the general, non-professional public don't care. They want them cheap, they want them fast and they want them to last.

If I had a pound for every time I explained the pros and cons of good and bad techs to my clients, I would be a rich woman. They simply don't want to listen. A lot of clients are looking for a quick or very short term fix and can't see why they should pay more to have a "decent" job done. Have of them can't even spot a decent job if it slapped them in the face.

Some honestly think that we are just trying to rip them off or that we have sour grapes ! If I hit my head against a brick wall, I would be more productive !

Yes, there are some clients that can spot the difference and appreciate the health of their nails and our skill etc etc, but they seem to be few and far between.


Marlise

 

[Sassy Hassy]

I'd like to add this to the debate if I may. I may be throwing the cat among the pigeons here, so here goes.......


My point is this, if somebody hasn't the business acumen or money to explore new avenues then are we perhaps being a bit harsh regarding other's ability to succeed?

Tracey, you can't debate if people don't throw opposing ideas into the pot, so thank you!

I have really picked up on your final question. I think you have to differentiate the difference between being employed and self employed, you can still be a nail tech being either, but to be self employed and run a succesful business takes more than being a nail tech. It means being business savvy. It may be being harsh, but being in business is harsh, and it takes a certain type of person to do this, and do it well!

And yes I agree that these places who offer short courses with the promise of immediately earning huge amounts of money are OUT OF ORDER! It is confusing to know what course is a good course and what is a bad course, and often you learn the hard and expensive way!

 

[pennijar]

What a great thread Sassy,

In light of some earlier comments, may I say that my NVQ Level 2 course, was thorough and taught by dedicated tutors, I wouldn't have started my training any other way, I know some are not so lucky at college, but the Image Centre at Wigan and Leigh College is a great place to study. So much so I am going back to do my Level 3 this September.

I don't know how techs who do a 2 or 3 day course can say they are fully qualified, a girl I used to work with did this and opened her own salon at the same time, It never seems to be open now though when I go past, so who knows what happened there. ok they teach you how to put nails on, but they don't go in depth into Health and Safety, Contra indications and Contra actions let alone Nail diseases and disorders, Anatomy and Physiology etc etc. I wonder in fact just how many of them could even label a nail diagram if they were given one to do.

So why do we all pay the same amount of Insurance, this is where the Industry needs to look for a governable standard, if you buy a car at 18 you do not expect to pay the same insurance as someone who has been driving for years and years, so why is it this way in the Nail Industry. It is wrong really wrong. When I go for my Insurance after 12 months at college and another Course up and coming this weekend, I will be expected to pay the same as someone who has done a 2 or 3 day course and nothing else the same goes for the Master Techs among us who have paid out thousands and thousands in training to reach the highest standards possible we all pay the going rate at the time. I think there should be a standard set about the minimum training allowable and I certainly feel it should be set far higher than one 2 or 3 day course and all Insurance companies should agree to this.

OK I know I will have made some enemies, but hey think about it before you neg rep me. Make comparisons with other types of insurance and you will see I am making a vallid point.

Joan

 

[CadenceAlex]

What a great thread Sassy,

In light of some earlier comments, may I say that my NVQ Level 2 course, was thorough and taught by dedicated tutors, I wouldn't have started my training any other way, I know some are not so lucky at college, but the Image Centre at Wigan and Leigh College is a great place to study. So much so I am going back to do my Level 3 this September.

I don't know how techs who do a 2 or 3 day course can say they are fully qualified, a girl I used to work with did this and opened her own salon at the same time, It never seems to be open now though when I go past, so who knows what happened there. ok they teach you how to put nails on, but they don't go in depth into Health and Safety, Contra indications and Contra actions let alone Nail diseases and disorders, Anatomy and Physiology etc etc. I wonder in fact just how many of them could even label a nail diagram if they were given one to do.

So why do we all pay the same amount of Insurance, this is where the Industry needs to look for a governable standard, if you buy a car at 18 you do not expect to pay the same insurance as someone who has been driving for years and years, so why is it this way in the Nail Industry. It is wrong really wrong. When I go for my Insurance after 12 months at college and another Course up and coming this weekend, I will be expected to pay the same as someone who has done a 2 or 3 day course and nothing else the same goes for the Master Techs among us who have paid out thousands and thousands in training to reach the highest standards possible we all pay the going rate at the time. I think there should be a standard set about the minimum training allowable and I certainly feel it should be set far higher than one 2 or 3 day course and all Insurance companies should agree to this.

OK I know I will have made some enemies, but hey think about it before you neg rep me. Make comparisons with other types of insurance and you will see I am making a vallid point.

Joan

With all due respect though, why should someone who is qualified to an NVQ level get the same price insurance as someone who is a Creative Grand Master?

It works both ways.

 

[gemsie1983]

Ok here goes..................................

Do you think that techs have a passion for nails and not for business?

What i mean by this is that techs love nails, but aren't interested in profit and loss accounts, payroll and all the other boring paperwork. And a lot of the time don't understand.

Thats why businesses fail? I mean if techs were actually interested in that they wouldn't be tech's but business advisor's etc.

Would it work better if a nail tech had a partner to run the business side but didn't do the nails.

I mean the people that make the clothes that are in the shops don't stand there selling them too!

 

[Sassy Hassy]

With all due respect though, why should someone who is qualified to an NVQ level get the same price insurance as someone who is a Creative Grand Master?

It works both ways.

Caroline I think that was the point that Joan was making, and it is something I had never thought about. Insurance premiums are based on risk - the likelihood of a claim being made.

Maybe we all get too hung up on the insurance issue. Let's face it, look at what the NSS do and how people put up with the pain and nail damage and think it's okay ...and they don't complain let alone put in an insurance claim! If they did, then we would ALL suffer because of the low standards of others because our premiums would increase... so coming full circle I think you have a valid point Joan!

 

[*Garfield*]

Ok here goes..................................

Do you think that techs have a passion for nails and not for business?

What i mean by this is that techs love nails, but aren't interested in profit and loss accounts, payroll and all the other boring paperwork. And a lot of the time don't understand.

Thats why businesses fail?

Yes, this is prob true in a lot of cases, but if you are in any business then ultimately you are in it to make money - if you dont make profit then you will fail, so its important to find out about all the boring stuff, if you dont want the responsilbility of all that goes with being self employed, or you dont have the passion to run your own business but love doing the creative side of things, then go and work in a salon and let the salon owner have the hassle!:hug:

 

[pennijar]

With all due respect though, why should someone who is qualified to an NVQ level get the same price insurance as someone who is a Creative Grand Master?

It works both ways.

Exactly that is my point!!!

Joan

 

[naturalnails]

....
So why do we all pay the same amount of Insurance, this is where the Industry needs to look for a governable standard, if you buy a car at 18 you do not expect to pay the same insurance as someone who has been driving for years and years, so why is it this way in the Nail Industry. It is wrong really wrong. When I go for my Insurance after 12 months at college and another Course up and coming this weekend, I will be expected to pay the same as someone who has done a 2 or 3 day course and nothing else the same goes for the Master Techs among us who have paid out thousands and thousands in training to reach the highest standards possible we all pay the going rate at the time. I think there should be a standard set about the minimum training allowable and I certainly feel it should be set far higher than one 2 or 3 day course and all Insurance companies should agree to this.

OK I know I will have made some enemies, but hey think about it before you neg rep me. Make comparisons with other types of insurance and you will see I am making a vallid point.

Joan

This is a very valid point - if you book insurance through ANT then you do pay different levels of insurance. However, when I enquired, because I have not done my NVQ, due in most part to the college assessor not being up to much, I would actually pay more, despite being a Creative Master technician with 6 years experience, than say someone who had done an NVQ at college - whatever college - they are all viewed the same for insurance purposes. Although I think it might be different now.

I went somewhere else for my insurance.

 

[gemsie1983]

Yes, this is prob true in a lot of cases, but if you are in any business then ultimately you are in it to make money - if you dont make profit then you will fail, so its important to find out about all the boring stuff, if you dont want the responsilbility of all that goes with being self employed, then go and work in a salon and let the salon owner have the hassle!:hug:

Yeah i agree with that one, but i feel that a lot of people take the self employed route because salons in general pay so poorly!

However if salons paid better they would make less profit which at the end of the day puts the tea on the table!

 

[Sassy Hassy]

Ok here goes..................................

Do you think that techs have a passion for nails and not for business?

What i mean by this is that techs love nails, but aren't interested in profit and loss accounts, payroll and all the other boring paperwork. And a lot of the time don't understand.

Thats why businesses fail? I mean if techs were actually interested in that they wouldn't be tech's but business advisor's etc.

Would it work better if a nail tech had a partner to run the business side but didn't do the nails.

I mean the people that make the clothes that are in the shops don't stand there selling them too!

You are so right! But again this comes back to the difference between being employed and self employed. You don't HAVE to be self employed to be a nail tech, but likewise if you want to be then you have to accept that to have a greater chance of success then you have to either invest your time, or someone else's, into getting sound business advice!

I can't remember the statistic but it is alarming the number of businesses that fail in their first year, and mostly it is because most people expect to open their doors and be fully booked. They are surprised when they advertise that their phone isn't ringing off the hook. They don't make financial provisions to invest back into the business, their working capital becomes zilch and then they have no money and no stock to carry on.

 

[*Garfield*]

Yeah i agree with that one, but i feel that a lot of people take the self employed route because salons in general pay so poorly!

However if salons paid better they would make less profit which at the end of the day puts the tea on the table!

But if someone has no business sense then they are prob not going to earn much anyway.....I know of some techs that are on less than £5 an hour, because they just have no clue about running a business - they would get at least £5.50 an hour in a salon! I mean, I wouldnt go and work in a salon beause they couldnt pay me more than what im earning now - but then I have good business sense!:lol: